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Is it possible to have seizures while remaining conscious? PLS HELP!!!
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I've had these "seizure-like" episodes for 5 months now. The first one I had started while I was sitting at my desk at work and I had an aura for about an hour where I got this zig-zag line in front of my eyes and I couldn't really see straight. I also couldn't think straight or speak straight. And when I tried to read something, I couldn't even sound out a simple word. Then when my sight started to return, my legs and body got very rigid and I could barely move, so much so that I could barely stand up or reach my arm out to get the phone. My body started tremoring for about 15 minutes. I was rushed to the hospital, but remained conscious through the whole thing. The paramedics and everyone else around me never said seizure. They all thought maybe it was hypoglycemia, or something like that. Well, 5 months later (and many neurological tests later), I'm still having episodes. (I've had about 24) They aren't always the same. But for the most part, now, I will be sitting and all of the sudden I won't be able to hold my head up anymore (or I'll get a feeling in the pit of my stomach), and then my hands will get all fidgety. This will escalate, until my foot kicks out, or my hand and eventually it's my whole upper and lower torso and head tremoring from anywhere from 5-30 minutes. It will be hard to speak and my breathing might get labored. I'm unable to move my own body at that point, so wherever I am having the episode is where I will be until the episode over, unless someone physically moves me. Sometimes it slows down and stops. Sometimes it stops abruptly. I am always totally exhausted afterward and have lots of trouble with my legs afterward, sometimes for an hour, sometimes for days. They get very weak and heavy feeling and sometimes will give out when I walk.
They seem to come in clusters, like I will have 4-7 episodes within a 2-3 week period and then I won't have any for 7-10 days. During the 7-10 days, I will feel good. During the 2-3 week period, I will feel very lethargic and weak most of the time.
I've had an MRI, MRA, MRV, EEG, 24 hr. EEG, CT scan of the brain, EMG, ECG, EKG, blood work... plus probably some more that I'm forgetting about that have all come back normal. One doctor even suggested pseudoseizures during an 8 day hospital stay, after he witnessed one of my episodes. This was because I responded to him (remained conscious) during my "seizure" and he thought I was making it up, I guess. I have two young children at home who have witnessed these episodes--I would not do that to them! I was screened by a psychologist who does not believe they are pseudoseizures.
So my question is, could they still be seizures, even though I am conscious? Or have any of you have similar episodes while remaining conscious and figured out what these episodes are? I'm sick of the "pseudoseizure" label I've been getting. I know something is physically wrong with me and I am trying to get to the bottom of it, but need some help from someone besides my doctors. Thanks.
Theresa
Recent Comments on this Discussion
This morning I was in bed and my eyes were open I was conscious, I could think clearly I could hear the radio in the pother room and see the light n the hall, but my body could not move,
I had my arm in the air then all of a sudden it dropped and felt like someone was pulling me off the bed, and i tried to yell out to my roomate but I couldnt speak, the I calmed my self tried to concentrate really hard and tried to speak again, still nothing, then I noticed my whole body was shaking , and i tohut to myself "am i having a siezure?" then i repeatedly tried calling to my roomie and couldnt make any audible noise, then i fociused really hard and thoguyht tro my self if only i could jsut get enogyh air coming out i might be able to make a noise, then bam "MICK" but it wasnt very loud and he still wasnt awake, and then all of a sudden everything stopped i could move and speak.
At some points it felt as thoguh i was watching myself but couldnt do anything.
It reminded me of "the old hag" or sleep paralisis, wehre you cant move but you can see and hear and some people report flaoting above there body and watching it happen, some people say it feels as thoguhsomeone is pinning htem down wit hthere hands and they see a old lady above them, hence the old hag term,
However this was different very similar in allot of ways but my body was convulsing and htats NEVER happend before
and hteres no history of siezures in my family that i heard of
Have you had an in patient vEEG yet?
I should also bring up that zig zag lines are often caused by migraine, so you might be having silent migraines that trigger psychogenic seizures. I really don't know, but that's just a shot in the dark. Maybe you should talk to a headache specialist.
I often can't move when I first wake up and my eyes are open. It happens when I have a bout of sleep paralysis but I still can't move even after I open my eyes. It's like my brain just isn't turned all the way on yet. I don't think it's uncommon to get kind of stuck between awake and dreaming to one degree or another.
Once I was dreaming that zombies were after me AND had sleep paralysis, so finally I managed to open my eyes up and I thought I could feel a zombie hand crawling up me. Hehe. It was really scary! Just because your eyes are open doesn't mean you're completely awake.
Hi Theresab! yes. you can have seizures and be aware that you're having them and just not have any ability to do anything about them. I was having lunch with my sister and had one in the middle of the restaurant. All the sudden I couldn't speak and my hand made some kind of criss/cross pattern on my chest - like i crossed my heart. I knew i was doing it, and still remember it - she was going "karen? karen?" the whole time, but i couldn't answer her or stop doing what i was doing. it was pretty humiliiating. Karen
It is possilbe to ahve seizures while consious.
However, they are few and far between. having gone through 3 or years of medical school leaning on being a neuro, I ahve some textbooks I can look in and give you information based on the medical aspect of what you want to know.
IF you have a Primary or Secondary TC, you will NEVER have consiousness. All consiousness is supressed during a convulsion, hence switching off or turning off the brain the same way you would a light switch.
Those seizures last an average of 2-4 minutes, occaisonally shorter or longer give or take. If those do go longer than 5 minutes, than emergency personel need to be contacted. Post-ictal for hours to days afterwards.
In Simple Partial seizures the consiousness does remain in tact, and those last anywhere from 30 secs-1 1/2 minutes. No post-ictal state.
In CPS the consiouness or awareness is altered or lost completey and this will vary for each person because of their set seizure pattern.
They will do the same things everytime, and their actions or automatisms will also remain the same.
These seizures last on average from 2-3 minutes. Postical for hours to days afterwards.
Myoclonic seizures involve quick muscle-jerk motions of the legs, hands, arms, shoulders, and neck. Awareness and consiousness is maintained during these seizures, and they only last a few seconds, no more. No post-ictal state.
In Absence seizures wether they are part of an adult syndrome, or a childhood syndrome, they cause loss of consiousness and last for 5-20 seconds, and can occur from as few times as around 50 to as many as 4-500 times a day. No post-ictal state.
Atonic seizures cause a very momentary lapse of consiousness and the person isn't even aware. They last 2-3 seconds. No post-ictal state
Tonic seizures cause a loss of consiousness for everything around them.
They get stiff like a bpoard and fall to the ground. They get cyanotic and have a fixed gaze like that of a TC. Post-ictal for hours to days afterwards.
Clonic seizures cause a loss of consiousness and are similair to TC except they only have the rhythmic jerking and no stiffening. They last 2-3 minutes. Postical for hours to days afterwards.
Nancy
I know what you mean about the pseudoseizure bit! I get sick of that myself. I was told I wanted attention to which I replied that I could find better ways of getting attention like climbing up on top of a table and doing a jig. That did not go over too well but for the life of me I do not know why anyone would want to have those kinds of feelings and things happening to their body to get attention. I know what you mean about the kids. I hated for my kids to see me when I was having an episode-- of course I was looking for attention!
You can remain total consious during a seizure-- I hardly ever loose conciousness and I usually never stop hearing. I cannot respond back but I am aware of what is going on around me most of the time even if it is a little distorted. I have been in a coma and I can tell you that while I was in the coma I HEARD EVERYTHING!! So do not let anyone tell you --even a doctor or a neurologist that just because you are aware it can't be a seizure. SPS which I have most of the time -- I do not loose conciousness and CPS sometimes I loose time awareness but I do remember most things. I will have some black out time but believe me it is not an attention getter. I'd rather go out in the middle of the busiest highway and yell at the top of my lungs than suffer from this!!
The "light shows"-- the squiggly lines and colored dots and such could be a migraine which also is connected with seizure activity. DO NOT LET DOCTORS BULLY YOU-- I have been at this for over a decade and the only real help you will get is when you stay as far away from Mental Health Pros as possible and find a neurologist who majors in Epilespy . Not all of them do and they don't always tell you that-- but you can tell by the way they treat you -- so I always ask if they are up on the Epilepsy info before I will hire them.
GOD BLESS YOU
Karol
You have no idea how much your reply has helped me. I will continue to pursue this until I am satisfied with my answer! I made an appointment with an epilepsy center yesterday and I am no longer continuing to see my old neurologist. I am taking my care into my own hands and not waiting for my doctors referrals anymore. Fortunately my insurance does not need referrals to specialists, so I can make my own appts. without needing someone else's permission first, so it's time I do this on my own.
Thank you from the bottom of my heart! God bless you too. And thank you for taking the time to answer me.
Theresa
That's what they thought mine were while I was in the hospital in July, but when I looked it up, it doesn't make any sense to me. You do lose consciousness in complex partial's from what I've read and you don't remember what happened. I've never had that.
Like you, I also have the whole body weakness.
I had another episode (seizure?) last night. This one started with a jolt, then another about 10 seconds later. This time I started smacking my leg with my hand. My husband saw me doing it and thought I was trying to stop the seizure or thought I was getting upset, but I told him, I'm not controlling this, this is happening to me. I've had that before, where I will smack myself in the forehead and yell out stop while it is happening, but it's just part of the seizure. My mother actually laughed about it one time after she witnessed it. She thought it was funny. Not very funny to me!
I hate this.
Thanks for writing to me.
Wow. That was kind of creepy reading the description of your 2 seizures where you are smacking your leg in one and hitting your head during another. I've had almost the exact same thing. I remain aware during my partial seizures (I've giving up caring to describe them as simple or complex - neurologist says complex...whatever!).
During one seizure last year, remember hitting my leg repeatedly for a few minute while moaning "kakakakakakkakak" over again, stuck on trying to say a word. During another one, I had sat down on my fire escape, leaned against the bars and started banging the back of my head against the bars maybe 20 times, saying "ouch ouch ouch" during it. I was afraid I'd hurt myself at the time, but couldn't stop.
As for your mom laughing when she saw you smack yourself, I have to say that I notice people often laugh when they're nervous or just don't know how to react to a weird situation. I get annoyed too, though, when someone laughs at something i'm doing during a seizure that i can't control.
Best of luck!
Warm regards,
Rebpow
I am so happy to hear that other people have whole body weakness episodes and remain conscious! I have the same problem. I am weak all the time now to one degree or another. My weakness has caused esotropia (crossed-eyes) and diminished reflexes, but still doctors won't admit that my symptoms are not all psychological.
I went into the Epilepsy Monitoring Unit for about 4 days but didn't have any significant episodes. Very frustrating! I did have some symptoms but I didn't report them because I knew that mild symptoms wouldn't show up on the EEG and I didn't want to get dismissed as a neurotic.
I've officially given up on doctors. Half of them are useless and the other half are useless jerks. I've decided to take B-Complex vitamins because I've also had megaloblastic anemia. Megaloblastic anemia and neurological symptoms such as numbness, weakness, and seizures is caused by B-vitamin deficiency. I sure hope it helps me!
Sometimes I can't move my left arm for a few minutes at a time. There is something called Todd's Paralysis that causes weakness and paralysis after seizures. Also, sometimes weakness can be the result of the seizure itself.
I've decided not to beg my doctors for seizure meds because I've never lost consciousness, although it has certainly been altered, and I've heard so many terrible stories about seizure medications on this board. I also can't be 100% sure that I'm having seizures.
If I ever loose consciousness then I'll go back to my nice epilepsy doctor and beg.
Here is more info on Todd's paralysis. Todd's Paralysis Information Page
It is reassuring to see some answers here that echo my own experiences. I have dodged the pseudoseizure/psychogenic seizure question for more than 11 years. It wears one down. When first I started having "events" thye were of unknown origin and without a name. Differential diagnosis included: Complicated migraines, seizures, MS, Lupus, and of course everyone's favorite, hysteria.
It was really frustrating to go through that process. The first time I had an event of unkown origin, I was hospitalized and the diagnosis of exclusion was complicated migraines. I was glad to have a name for it, but still was distressed to have had doctors question my mental health. (And yes, I know that it doesn't mean a person is crazy, per se, if he/she has this type of conversion disorder but it sure feels like your mental/emotional stability is in question.)
For the next eight years I struggled with complicated migraines. Mostly, it seemed like I'd have really bad migraines more than once a month, with a few episodes of more complicated migraines. I tried to take whatever medication was prescribed, eat correctly, sleep regularly and so on. But over time, the headaches got worse, not better. More frequent, insistant and debilitating. Finally, I ended up hospitalized 4 times in two years with severe headahces accompanied with shaking. Throughout all this time, I'd had the random EEGs, CAT Scans, MRIs, and so on, also I'd had numerous neuropsych and psychological evaluations. The result over and over again was that I did not have a profile consistant with a person who develops psychogenic phenomenon. Didn't stop it from being a question raised though.
I was given one random EEG back in Feb. '06 which showed an abnormal finding. I wasn't hopeful at that point that anything would come of it. I'd had others over the years that were later classified as "infarct," meaning useless information obscuring the picture. But the neurologist I was seeing by then sent me for a 24hour EEG, then a 3 day video monitoring EEG. The result was a diagnosis of nocturnal seizures, and "definitive right sided electrical discharge" which I believe she labeled as complex partial seizures.
You would imagine that this would make life better, and to some extent that is true, as I have finally been given two medications, first Keppra then also Lamictal. Yet still I've had breatkhrough seizures, and the diagnosis of pseudoseizure follows me. I have to the best I can tell several versions of seizure. I have had a diagnosis of ADHD since age 3, and I have long had a habit of "staring off into space" When I was a kid. I was literally paying more attention to my own thoughts then to what is going on around me. In recent years, it was brought to my attention that sometimes I just seem to "go away somewhere." This would be different from my deliberate looking out of the window and choosing to engage my thoughts outside of the childhood classroom. It's usually brought to my attention by someone asking me "Hello? Are you listening? Where did you go justnow?" and that's the first I know I'm doing it. I have begun to suspect this may actually be an abscence seizure, and it often shows itself preceeding more obvious "seizure like" events.
The nocturnal seizures were found via EEG while I thought I was sleeping. I would have no earthly idea otherwise that I have them. I noticed that I woke up stiff in the morning, creaky like an old lady in my bones. I noticed that I was fuzzy headed when I woke up and that I felt like I hadn't really gotten "any good sleep" I had no idea this was all related to seizing in my sleep. How on earth could I? I just thought I was a bad sleeper. I've always had some insomnia, and tossed and turned while sleeping. I plied myself with coffee during the day and talked about getting a better mattress. Those chronic headaches and fatigue issues I had during the days, turned out to be "post-ictal" or at least that's the current theory as they went away with time.
I do still carry a diagnosis of complex migraines, but some of the things that went with that, like the type of aura, the transient boughts of left-sided heaviness, seem to be related in part to the seizure diagnosis.
As to the other type of seizure, here is where it get's difficult. I have a kind of seizure, where I have not fallen down, but felt the need to sit down, lie down, or similar. I often wander around before hand, feeling tired, draggy, and inexplicably less connected or capable of speech. I get word searching or difficulty with saying the words I mean in the hours preceeding this issue. When the event hits, I flail my arms rythmically and shake my head, followed by a stiffening of my muscles, then a sense of fatigue. I am able to hear what's going on around me, but I can't really speak back and sometimes it takes me a few minutes afterward before I can get out words fully. Early attempts will produce sounds like "tuh-tuh-tuh." I used to think I was fully aware of the entire experience, and missed nothing, only to be told later about things I didn't remember, take in or perhaps understand at the time. (Who knows which.) I have often experienced left-sided heaviness, fatigue, and sometimes a curling of my fingers into my hand, with hand to arm, and arm towards chest. This does all go away, after some period of time.
Problem is, it can happen that way several in a row, or recurring more than once or twice a quarter. So it really messes up my quality of life. I have also struggled with athe ongoing fight between autonomy and compliance. i want to go out and have a cocktail once in a while. (Like once a month maybe?) I want to do more than go to work and come home during the week, without becoming run down. And to see my friends on Saturday nights. I'm not looking to party, but I want to be able to stay up late sometimes. I think my wishes are modest, and yet I have found that failure to keep enough sleep, nutrition, and stress in balance, gets me sick every single time.
When first I only had a diagnosis of migraines, I had doctors that gave me heavy duty pain meds. I took them because I couldn't make the migraines go away, but I had to go to work, and keep food on the table. So I did what I could and dulled the pain, threw up when I needed to and kept going. It was many years later that I learned that my use of narcotics was setting me up for "rebound headaches" and could "lower the seizure threshold." So in addition to the question of "psychogenic seizures" I also get to fight the prejudice of whether I was abusing drugs. I contend it wasn't so, as I never took drugs to get high, or escape. I took them, as prescribed by a physician, to treat intractable pain. But that argument goes nowhere.
Recently I ended up in the ER, with a continued set of seizure like events happening for more than 30 minutes that night. I got my records, so I can follow up and found those same old words, pseudoseizure in them. I am so terribly disappointed, again. I thought things would be different now that there was documented proof of seizures on EEGs. Where do I go now?
I do not know if you finally got an answer I know this is a very old post however.......
I am most likelly a different sitaution then most and I want to state this because I am a head injury patient however I have been alert when I have had seizures I been having seizures since my first head injury and I have sustained Multiple Head inuries in my life time since I was 6 years of Age I am now 35 this Dec 2008.....
I have had siezures where I was in the present of Doctors, Nurses, Friends, Family members, Teachers, Ect.... I have them where I have heard people and where I haven't heard people.... Where I cannot talk after for a good 20 to 30 minutes after to where I can talk right after..... I have incidents where I been on medications where I sound like a idiots because I cannot talk.... I am going through this right now....
I have been able to do mild things for the doctors right after my seizure but I ended up with a migraine right after my seizure...... or riging in my ears or a consitant pounding in my head or thrubing in my eyes and my eyes hurt so bad I can not open then and it hurts my eyes to open them.
I have had Nuerologist tell me I am a lieing sack of crap and I need to see a psychologist.... Well I already see one of them because I have frontal lobe brain damage which I now have major depression and a organic mood disorder due to the frontal lobe brain damage which affects my behaiors personailty and emotions
However I am not faking this crap this is actually happen to me and that is what really annoys me with these doctors is that they just pawn it off on my mental condition because they cannot find a reason for it so because they cannot find a reason for it they blame it on my mental problems..... It drives me absolutly nuts.... So I get to live with this problem I get to live with what ever goes on with me and I get to go through life in hell just because these doctors do not want to try to keep searching for a reason?????
Why do we have doctors if they are not going to try to find a cure for what is going on for our medical problems????? That is my question......
I hope you found out what is wrong with you.....
Anna
I thought to add that my neuro suggested they might be either partial complex seizures towards the beginning before ruling it out with testing. Then recently he said something like I have "tonic-clonic" tendencies with possible autonomic neuropathy. Like I have any idea what that means.
Also, he did put me on Depakote from day one for two and a half months until I begged him to put me on something else because I gained 20+ lbs and lost a lot of hair, and now I am on Topamax 100 mg. twice a day. He says this is to control the tremors that I have-not for actual seizures, and also to prevent migraines, which I also suffer from.
Please write back.
I remain concious when I have my seizures. I get a tingling in my body like other people have described here. I can hear people talk to me and can try to follow Directions, but its hard for me to Respond to them. I am like in slow motion, they say something and when the Seizure is over, I respond.
Leah
I am remain concious when i get seizure attacks from the beginning of my epilepsy history. Before my seizure attacks, i am like in slow motion,somehow cant speak, no respond to others, even cant walk. people thought that i am pretending but i have no control on those weird symptoms.i feel tired and fall to sleep after the attack.
Did the seizure activity show up on your EEG?
Do you know what type of seizure these are? I learned about simple partial seizures yesterday, which I never heard of before, where you can remain conscious and have a seizure. I am wondering why my doctors never looked into or even mentioned these to me.
Thanks for responding.
Theresa
At the beginning of my epilepsy history, doctor just diagnosed the seizures encountered by me as "psychology problem", i am over pressured in my study. Because of doubt of that diagnosed, i went for EEG in a specialist hospital. yap, no seizure activity show up in my EEG test even though doc triggered my seizures attack by force using "special lightning".i was subscribed with psychotic medicines because they believed that i am not one of those epileptic victims. Sure, my seizure was not under control by taken those "crazy medicine" instead worsen my condition. Abnormal brain wave was found in my second time EEG test after few years. Then i only started taken my epileptic medicine under supervision of doctor about 3 years ago. Recently i learned about got 20% probability epilepsy victims got seizure attacks with normal brain wave activity in EEG test. Some of them no seizure attacks with abnormal brain wave detected in EEG.
i know that u are stressed and worried. i am in the same boat. i have seiz like urs up until the tremors, but i also have a brain tingle. anyway there are so many people that will answer ur post. every one is so nice and VERY knowledgable. on tonic and complex seiz,,, if u read some other posts, (cannot remember whichone) i asked the same question in a post, and someone answered and knew there stuff. it helped me so much, so find that. and the med (only b/c i am a student rn) topamax is a med for partial seiz in children 2-16yrs old, tonic seiz in lennox-gastaut syndrome. it is also used for bipolar disorder, cluster headache, infantile spasms. it action is to prevent seiz spread. of course do not take any herbs or drink alcohol.
i hope that i helped some.
That's interesting about Topamax. My neuro said I'm basically taking it to control the tremors and to prevent migraines (and I think the weight loss side effect was one he wished for me too-unfortunately that one isn't helping me).
He believes I have something called Orthostatic tremors. I have low blood pressure and I have orthostatic hypotension (they believe-because I failed a tilt table test) where my blood pressure will drop if I stand too long and the blood will pool in my legs and deprive my brain of the oxygen it needs, leaving me weak, leading to almost a faint. He believes that all my symptoms are due to this. Except that, I tell him my episodes occur when I am sitting, standing, laying down, and also, I check my blood pressure and my blood pressure is not low at that time(!), so how can that be right??? He never answers me.
It seemed that when I first started taking the Topamax (50 mg twice a day), the episodes would still occur the same way, then he increased my dosage to 100 mg twice a day and the tremors pretty much stopped for about a month (but not the episodes). Now they are coming back again during the episodes.
I'm trying to find an epilepsy center in a hospital in my area to contact today. I'm not even giving my neuro a second chance at this point. 5 months is long enough to live like this without knowing what is the real deal.
Thanks for your help. Sure doesn't sound like this med is the right one for me. If you could let me know where your previous post is, I would love to read it. I'll try to find it if I can though.
Theresa
beautimouslove, I found your post. Thanks for letting me know about it-it helped a lot. I'm so sorry about what you're going through. I hope you can find some answers today and get some financial help with the medical bills too.
Theresa